Soul Touched by Dogs

Welcome to the Soul Touched by Dogs
Podcast, the show for dog lovers who

see dogs not as toys or tools, but
wise souls worth our respect and care.

I'm an Herrmann, and I'm your host.

I talk to poor some humans, people who
do great work for dogs and their people.

So come and join us for
today's conversation.

Anke: Hello and welcome, Hannah.

I love starting a conversation
with a good giggle.

Oh, yeah, so I agree.

what it's about when you're listening.

So you're going to have to hang in there.

Hello, welcome, Hannah.

I'm delighted to have you here.

Hana: Thank you.

I'm absolutely thrilled to be here, Anke.

Anke: So, well, let's just
start right at the beginning.

Let people know where you're based,
where you're from, where you're

based, and what's your business.

Hana: Um, so I'm Hanna Mäkkinen.

I'm an animal communicator and I
specialize, um, in animal, well, obviously

animal communication, but Most of my
practice is working with pet parents on

the end of life journey with their pet.

Um, helping them, um, navigate,
um, a more compassionate

ending, be that euthanization,
hospice, or palliative care.

And then I'm also helping pet parents in
the afterlife and giving communications.

And I offer, like, grief
and support sessions.

And I'm also a grief, um, specialist.

I've trained with.

Uh, David Kessler as well.

And I've gone to the Gurney
Institute of Animal Communication.

I'm originally from Finland, but,
uh, raised, uh, in Canada, in Western

Canada, primarily, and currently I'm
residing in, uh, Alberta, Canada.

Yeah.

Anke: So I'm now curious,
how does one get into that?

Like, I mean, I would imagine, you know,
you come out of school, somebody asks you,

So, Hannah, what do you want to be when,
you know, like, Specializing in end of

life for animals, I would imagine, maybe?

You know, was that what you were thinking
of, or did that have a little detour

Hana: to get there?

Oh, it's been a journey,
actually, to get here.

Um, I have Experienced a lot of
traumatic pet deaths, um, throughout

my childhood and throughout my life.

And death was something that
was never openly spoken about.

And, you know, growing up in the
60s and 70s, You know, our pets,

when it was time for them to pass,
my parents would just take them to

the vet and they wouldn't come home
and then we wouldn't talk about it.

And I was like, where'd they go?

Like, I wouldn't have a chance to say
goodbye, or in some instances I would

have a chance to say goodbye, but I wasn't
allowed in there because it was deemed as

a child, like, you shouldn't be in there.

Um, and at 17 I was, uh, forced to
make the most difficult decision of my

life, uh, which was a horse of mine who
was, um, my best friend my entire life.

Uh, I really believe that he got me
through my, the angst of the teenage

years and, um, he had fractured, uh, the
patella in his, in his knee, uh, his knee

bone, and, um, My parents asked me to and
told me that I was the one responsible

to make the choice for his outcome.

So here at 17 with no guidance, and then
I shut down, um, because at 17 with no

grief awareness, my parents didn't know
how, and it isn't something that you're

talked about, and back then animals were
seen not as family members to the level

or that impact that they have in our life.

And It's through all that and my parents
fear of death, my fear of death, um, it

was about, I, I always get mixed up with
time, so every interview it's slightly

different, uh, between 20 and 30 years
ago, um, when we were doing the end

of life journey with my grandmother.

It was my aunt who taught me a different
way to do death, and she walked me through

it, and I realized, oh, this is hard,
this is sad, this is really emotional,

but it doesn't have to be scary.

And Later, probably another decade after
that, I came to animal communication.

And friends of mine always say I tend
to be a death magnet or the death queen.

Um, because people call me when,
uh, a family member is dying.

I've, I've uh, helped in,
in, uh, palliative care for

family members and friends.

And it's just a natural place
that I'm literally drawn to.

I can't imagine myself not doing this.

Um, and it has just happened.

So when I went into animal
communication, um, it just naturally

evolved to start doing end of life.

And the whole end of life journey, uh,
helping clients when I'm in person, um, be

present with them during, um, the ending
or the euthanization with their pet.

Um, so it's just, it's, it's become
a natural progression and I honestly

wouldn't want to be anywhere else.

Like I just spent the last 10
months with hospice care with my

mother and I was there for her final
breath three months ago and her.

That time of end of life with her
just feeds me and I see how the human

side and the animal side both relate
because the animals when I'm working

with clients, I'm helping explain to
them that we don't need to have the

fear, um, even though I acknowledge
that they have fear, but I help them

find a pace of, um, peace and presence.

I never take anyone's pain away because
I can't, that's not my job, but.

I can help unburden guilt and regret so
they can have a different perspective

and really find the sacred love
that is present during end of life.

Because this is the place that
I have discovered, like I have

spent over 10 years with dementia
journeys with both of my parents.

So I have literally lived a decade of
end of life of losing them every day.

You know, two years, two and a half years
ago, I lost my soul dog as well, and I,

I have so much personal experience in
grief, but I'm also learning in that,

that pain and love coexist, and they're
there to help each other, and when we can

go through without the fear of it, we can
really find a sense of presence, and Be

in the bittersweetness of the situation
and know that we're going to be okay.

Anke: Do you find, I mean that just
kind of reminds me like my first dog

passed away like two, two and a half,
like a bit over two years ago now.

And I remember one, and he was almost,
he was 16 and a half, you know, so

I was like Kind of proud that he'd
had a long, you know, he came as this

little street, you know, street puppy.

So I found him in the street
at four months, like a little

traumatized little pup.

And so I promised him at the time, I was
like, I'm going to do whatever I can to

make sure you have a good life, you know?

And I sort of felt like, well, yeah, you
know, I delivered kind of thing, you know?

And I think one of the things I remember
as like really Soothing was that

sense of not having regrets, right?

There was nothing I felt guilty about.

And, and so I wonder, is that
something that burdens a lot of people?

Because you mentioned it and
I'm thinking like, what is it

that people come to you for?

Because I just remind my own
experience was like literally

knowing that, look, there was.

I didn't mess up here, you know, like
he passed away at a decent age, you

know, he was well right to the end.

There was nothing where I go, Oh, if I'd
done this or that, like, you know, none

of that second guessing, you know, so it
was like, what I can give you is be here

with you, like right to the very end.

And, and, but there was no.

Yeah, no sense like, oh, I wish I
had, you know, and I'm like, I don't,

I, this would be so much harder.

Is this something that's common

Hana: when people come to you?

It's, it, it, it's really common,
but there's also a function

that I want people to know.

So they need to be gentle with themselves.

There's a few tangents
I'm going to go off of.

First of all, I want to go to our animals.

When they're getting ready to
pass, they're, they're aware

their time is coming to an end.

They're often waiting for us
as the humans to become ready.

So it's, it's still a team.

It's still a partnership in getting
ready to companion them to their end.

And they're still companioning you.

They're still helping you
and you're helping them.

It's a mutual relationship.

But animals don't understand.

Guilt.

Guilt is a human made, um, I don't
even know if it's an emotion really,

it's a feeling of some sort, but It has
been made, uh, and animals are always

confused because they are actually
pained when they see us in pain or,

um, doubting or questioning ourselves
because they always see our true light.

And when they see us in guilt, it's, um,
it, it actually, it pains them because

they want us to be free because the guilt
is taking us away from the moment, but in

my, my grief work and my experience in,
in working with clients, like we come with

our guilt for whatever reason we come with
and we're always questioning, but I've

also realized that it is our mind's way.

of also protecting us and wondering
what could I have done differently?

What if I did this?

What if I did that?

And that it, I want people to
realize it's not really negative.

It's heavy and it can
influence your guilt.

or your grief, sorry, but the guilt also
does serve a purpose because the pain

in our heart and our body is so big that
sometimes we're not ready and we have

to go through the scenarios that what
if I did this and this and this but if

we could go through it and be Kinder and
gentler and have more self compassion to

ourselves when we do it or understand,
Oh, wow, the pain's got to be really

bad if I'm going through all these
scenarios because we're always searching.

And I think as a society, we've
kind of been conditioned into,

um, what we've done wrong, but in
our animals eyes, we've never done

anything wrong because They know.

I have complete goosebumps,
so when I get goosebumps, this

is just an absolute download.

They know everything we're doing for them
is in love, but can we, as the human, find

self forgiveness and self compassion in
going, we only know what we can know in

the moment we're in, and when we learn
and know better after, we'll do better.

This is the teaching moment with
the present animal that we're with.

is this moment and that guilt if
we as humans find again that self

love and go, huh, okay, this is why.

And we become curious about it and
we can hold ourselves in it and give

ourselves permission to be in it
and release that often most people

once they can flip the switch.

on that.

That's what helps people come to
a place of peace, but also to feel

the overwhelming emotion of grief.

So many of us are more
afraid of our emotions.

And we think we're going to get
stuck in it, and we think we're

going to stay in it, and we
think we can't come back from it.

I just want to say, if we think of the
weather, It's never sunny all the time.

Storms don't last forever.

Some storms are really destructive
or blizzards, you know, they can be

destructive, but they don't last forever.

They can leave.

You changed.

And the death of a beloved
dog, the, the death of a loved

one will leave you changed.

But it doesn't mean that
you need to remain broken.

It's finding how am I going to
rise through this and from this.

Because the only way to really be with
our animal during end of life And to be

truly present, is to walk through it.

And do you

Anke: find, like, suppressing
us is what kind of probably

makes it stuck a long time?

Oh, gosh, absolutely.

Because I don't know, because I remember,
like, one thing I remember doing when

Leo went was like, I just allowed myself
to kind of just like, go in it, right?

Yes, yes.

So it was just like, yeah, I
cancelled a whole bunch of calls

and, you know, just literally, Yeah.

Allow myself to feel it because
it feels like it allows it

to pass through, you know,

Hana: it does.

And like, I, I let people know often
that, um, anytime the pain comes

up or the tears just start flowing.

If you think of it, that.

And you give yourself the permission
to allow yourself to feel it, you're

removing a little bit of that pain
and grief, and then you create space,

and it's that space after, because, I
mean, most, most women know, um, after

a good cry it's We feel really good.

So that's the space because we've
taken that burden out of us.

And in that space, we now
have a little more energy or

a little more love to come in.

Sometimes in the first, you know,
days or weeks after the loss, after

such a large emotional release,
we're tired and we're exhausted.

And that's normal.

So then we go sleep and
take care of ourselves.

But we'll notice that over time, more
space develops and more space develops

in between what I call the grief bursts.

And then that's, but just know that
every time you're, you're dealing

with your grief in a healthy manner,
that you're releasing a little bit.

And more love and more memories
and more joy can begin to come in.

So

Anke: where can people like, you know,
I think this, you know, everybody I know

has gone through this or has kind of, is
kind of scared of when it comes, right?

Oh gosh, yes.

How can they get in touch with you?

Where can they go?

What's the first place you'd send them to?

Hana: Yeah, um, so my website
is, uh, called End and After.

So it's, uh, you know, endandafter.

com and my little tagline
is for all new beginnings.

And on Instagram and Facebook, you
can find me on End and After Medium.

And you can like and follow and subscribe.

You can sign up to my newsletter.

Um, I have lots of blogs.

A lot of people go there and read
that and find solace in that.

I do have a YouTube channel as well and
an after medium, um, that people can

go and look at some of the, the videos
there to see if they find it helpful.

And, uh, Yeah, I'm presently working on
an online course to, to help, uh, more

pet parents, um, in their time of need
because there's only one of me, um, and

I can't be available all the time and
I serve people all around the world.

Love

Anke: it.

And I think we'll have to,
we'll have to have you back when

that's, when that's ready to go
because this was way too short.

so much.

so much.

This has been lovely.

So, so helpful for people and I'm really

Hana: Thank you.

I'm honored to be here
and thank you so much.

I really appreciate it.

Thanks so much for listening.

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And if you know a pawsome human
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I'd love an introduction.

Email me at Anke.

That's A N k E at Soul
touched by dogs.com.