Soul Touched by Dogs

Welcome to the Soul Touched by Dogs
Podcast, the show for dog lovers who

see dogs not as toys or tools, but
wise souls worth our respect and care.

I'm an Herrmann, and I'm your host.

I talk to poor some humans, people who
do great work for dogs and their people.

So come and join us for
today's conversation.

Anke: Hello and welcome, Kathy.

I'm delighted to have you here.

Kathy: I'm delighted to be here.

Thank you so much.

I'm, I'm looking forward
to chatting with you.

Anke: Me too, me too.

And people will be looking forward
to listening once they know

what we're talking about today.

So before we dive in there, let
people know where you're based and

so what's your business with dogs?

Kathy: Sure, sure.

So I am in Alexandria, Virginia, which
is right outside of Washington, D.

C., and I am a dog trainer and a dog
writer, dog author, and a foster.

So we have fostered, our family started
fostering 10 years ago, um, and we

have now had, I think we're on 235.

puppies through our house.

So we take them in, we love them
up, we get them ready, and we

send them out into the world.

And that is what has kind of deeply
informed my outlook on what puppies

really need, um, and how we can
help new owners, um, transition more

happily and joyfully into puppyhood.

Because, um, often that ends up being
a pretty shocking transition, much

harder than people expect, and it really
doesn't have to feel that way, so.

The, the new book is, um, Welcoming
Your Puppy from Planet Dog.

And the idea is that I really want
to help people understand where this

puppy's coming from and how they can
meet him right there so that they

can have the fun that I have with all
these puppies going through my house

with it being a happy thing instead
of sort of a, what have I done moment.

Anke: Oh, I love that.

I love that so much.

It's like, I was saying before I
checked out your Instagram account,

I was just drooling all over.

Like, oh my god, this woman lives in
heaven with all these little puppies.

It's like little fluffballs all day long.

It is

Kathy: true.

So it is true.

So we will take in, you know,
so I have two sides of, My

whole life being with puppies.

One side is the volunteer side when
I have all, when we're raising the

literature and the other side is
working with the clients and bringing

those client puppies here or going
to their homes and working with them.

Either way, my days are filled
with fluffy little puppies

and it could not be more fun.

It's just a delight.

And yeah, you can find it all
on Instagram, which is fun.

Anke: I will obviously pop the
link in the show notes and below

this video if you want to watch it.

So.

I mean, you know what, funny enough, what
the first question that pops to my mind

is, like, how do you deal with them going?

Like, it's like, I kind of like,
if I see a puppy, it's like,

I get so attached so quickly.

It's like, what's that
like to let them go?

Kathy: That is, in fact,
everybody's, for every real dog

owner, that's their first question
when they find out that we foster.

And in fact, that was our first question
too, when we pondered starting fostering

is, how in the world would we let them go?

Um, And it is a legit
concern because it is hard.

And I can tell you that the first year
or so, I always cried the night before,

um, because it felt like a betrayal.

You know, we had gotten
them in, they were scared.

We pulled them in here.

We've gotten them okay.

Our dogs play a big role in
making them feel comfortable.

I think our dogs, our dogs are amazing.

And they just translate in two seconds
what might take us days or even a week.

Hey.

Anke.

It's good here.

You're safe here.

Anyway, they all get so
comfortable here and yeah, you

feel terrible giving them up.

But here's what actually happens
then within maybe three days.

You have started to get these
pictures of this puppy, all happily

ensconced in his new family.

And you just look at their smiles,
you look at his glee, and you're

like, Oh right, oh right, I
forgot, I am just the link here.

This is just, and it becomes
deeply, you're quite sure.

that you are supposed to
just be this transition.

We are their safe landing, we're their
soft landing, we get them, move them from

a world of risk into a world of safety.

And we're just the, we're
just the thing in between.

And it is a delightful role to play.

And because it turns out okay.

I can still say goodbye to the puppies.

In the beginning I didn't
have enough evidence.

In the beginning I didn't know
if it was going to turn out okay.

I didn't know how the
puppies were going to do.

But years and years and years of evidence
have shown me that almost always, holy

mackerel, it turns out beautifully.

It, it, it does.

Things happen the way they're supposed to
and I often am still in touch with these

puppies because many of them because I'm
obnoxious on social media I am constantly

posting these puppies and so people
in my zip code end up with my puppy.

So I'm not kidding you I'm walking
down the street and I will see

in different neighborhoods.

I'll be like, oh look there's
a puppy There's Piper.

Look, there's Lulu.

And that is very rewarding and fun.

Yep.

We have some frequent flyers too.

We have several families who at
this point have gotten two fosters

from us, which is awfully fun.

Anke: Oh, I love that.

I love it.

So.

I mean, I don't know, like I've had
like neighbors and things when there's

like, oh, we got a puppy and then like
literally days later they were frustrated.

It was crying all the time, you
know, and I'm sort of thinking, for

God's sake, don't you have any bit
of patience, any bit of compassion?

So what's the, what are typical
mistakes or misunderstandings or

misconceptions or, or like false
expectations that people often have

and obviously don't want to do instead.

Kathy: What's the answer?

Yeah.

So that's really it.

So, so we, I often get people calling
me maybe two weeks later, maybe

three, and truly they're like, okay,
I think this might've been a mistake.

And they feel terrible saying it out
loud, but that's truly, they're lying

awake thinking, what have I done?

My life was perfect before and
now it's miserable because of

the 24 7 nature of puppies.

You know, they're peeing, they're
pooping, they're chewing, they're

biting the kids, they're jumping up.

The kids were begging for the
puppy, then they got the puppy, now

they're crying and saying, I hate
the puppy, the puppy's biting me.

So, I'm All that stuff takes them
by surprise because there's some

kind of myth about what puppyhood
is supposed to be like in our life.

We all think it's supposed
to be easy to have a dog and

having a puppy will be glorious.

And it can be.

But first you need to set yourself up.

So, so the thing that I tell folks,
so when they call me in that misery,

I will come and I'll do a consult with
them and they'll often have a little

notebook, you know, pull out their
little notebook and they're ready to

write down all of my tips and tricks.

And I tell them, I do have those things.

I have approaches and techniques
I'd love for you to try, but

none of them will work for you.

Because right now you're
not in the right mindset.

Puppyhood is a mindset game.

And if you can get in the
right headspace for it, you're

going to be able to enjoy it.

So what I tell them to get them
there is, there's one thing I want

you to write in that notebook today.

And it is, this is a baby.

That I've kidnapped from another planet.

Baby kidnapped planet.

So this is, nobody wants to hear that.

Makes you feel bad.

And I tell them, I don't say this to make
you feel sad, but usually when you say

that people kind of instinctively get it.

Um, these puppies have been rolling
around, having a ball with their

own families, doing doggy things.

They've been chewing and digging
and biting and wrestling.

They've always had a friend.

Right next to them.

They have never slept alone and no
one has gotten mad at them for all

of those very natural doggy things.

One day someone plucked them out.

They didn't know what was going to happen.

The humans have been looking
forward to this forever.

The puppy hasn't.

And then the humans grab him.

The humans are so excited.

Guess what?

The puppy is devastated.

Now, obviously, if you have an incredible
breeder or an incredible foster, um,

situation, they have been doing everything
they can to prepare the puppy for this

moment of separation, giving them a little
time alone, but often that's not the case.

And this is the first time they
actually are taking a breath without

all of their littermates next to them.

You bring them into your house
and then what happens is the puppy

starts to Doing all the things
that come naturally to dogs.

They are still biting, wrestling,
digging, chewing, pooping, peeing.

And suddenly all they hear is no.

And their only family no is you.

And because it hasn't been set up
right and you don't have the right

expectations, you are filling that
relationship with a bunch of nos.

And that is how this puppy's starting
off in this new planet on planet human.

All he hears is no.

So that's not what we want to do.

You're upset.

The puppy's upset.

Nothing good is happening.

Stress is rising in the household.

Does not have to be this way.

So, the key is to remember, Hey,
baby, kidnapped, another planet.

Hmm, what does he need?

And the number one thing this
baby needs is to feel safe.

This baby needs to feel safe, needs
to feel like he can trust you.

And the best way for you to help him
feel that way is with your setup.

You need to think through how
you're going to set up your house.

So the big mistake I see people
doing is giving the puppy either

too much space or too little space.

So if you give a puppy too much space,
they are going all over your house.

Of course, they're going
to pee and poop everywhere.

You're not even going to notice it.

You might be like, gosh,
he's doing so well.

I don't think he's peed at all inside.

And I go into those consults and
I'm like, uh oh, Spaghetti O,

let's check behind the couch here.

Um, so, uh, so too much space
is bad and too much space also,

it allows for a lot of mistakes.

because your kids are there, your precious
items there, all your shoes are there.

So all those no's are waiting in every
single corner for the puppy to bump

into so that then you're like, Hey, no.

And then once again, you're interfering
with your relationship there.

So too much space is bad.

So the opposite though
is too little space.

Sometimes people, but often before
they get the puppy, it feels really

terrific to set up a tiny little pen
and be like, that's where the puppy is.

Puppy will be, and you kind of feel great
because you're like, hey, our life is

going to go on as normal, but then the
puppy will be in the pen and you put

all the toys in the pen and the crate
in the pen and it all feels doable.

Well, then you get the puppy
and the puppy quies in the pen.

He quies and quies and quies.

And the truth is you don't
want to go in that pen either.

It's kind of too small.

So you go in there like the first day
or two, but then you're like, ugh.

I don't want to be in the pen.

Well, and the puppy doesn't want to
be without you because again, he's a

baby kidnapped from another planet.

He wants to be with you.

He doesn't feel secure.

He needs you right next to him so he can
start to realize this is his new family.

So, Um, so the best setup is if
you make a little puppy apartment.

It needs to be smaller than
the house, bigger than a pen.

And so the ideal thing is, I love
to get clients, if we can sort of do

gates on the kitchen or something.

This becomes sort of a big problem, a lot
of people have these beautiful open plan

homes and that becomes kind of a problem,
but you can get, there are great products

out there that you won't hate, that are
kind of beautiful, that can be temporary.

Remember this is all temporary.

But if you can section
off your house and create.

A lovely space where you are happy
hanging out with your puppy for

the first few weeks, maybe two
months, then you are going to, boy,

is everything going to be easier.

Potty training is going to come easily.

Um, chewing and biting on the kids is
going to come easily because you've

got a management system in place.

The, the kids come down, it's exciting.

The puppy can't get into the pattern
of getting paws up on the kids and

mouth Mouth dragging those pants
because you've got the gate there.

So it gives you a chance to get your
act together and ask for something.

Play a little, find it, ask for a
little sit, play a little, find it, ask

for a little sit, puppy gets used to.

Oh, listening to words
is rewarding for me.

This is fun.

And all four, four, um,
paws are on the floor.

If you're playing, find it.

And that mouth is directed to the ground.

If you're playing, find it.

Now your four year old can come into
the area, continue playing, find it.

And they got into a good pattern.

Later, in a few weeks, you won't even
need to be doing that because the pattern

when the kid comes into the room is,
Oh, we walk around, I stay on the floor.

They never got into the
pattern of jumping and biting.

And the jumping and biting, all that
is, is the puppy's need for engagement.

That's how puppies engage with each other.

They're simply engaging with you.

You're all they've got.

Of course, they're going to engage.

Jump up and use their teeth.

It's up to us to teach this
little alien from another planet

how we do it on planet human.

And so you just need tricks
up your sleeve like that.

You need to set up some management,
set up your puppy apartment,

and then have some ideas.

You got to anticipate how you're going to
teach this puppy to succeed in this world.

And you need to understand and totally
expect that he's going to come at you

as a dog, not as a little baby human.

And so if you set him up for a bunch
of yeses, he's Remove the nose.

Like, so that puppy apartment
is not filled with stuff for him

to chew and pee on and destroy.

Instead, it's filled with great toys for
him, appropriate chew items, so he begins

to develop all the patterns, all the
good patterns we want to see him doing,

which is Chewing on the right stuff.

Of course he's going to chew.

Make sure he's got good stuff to chew on.

Of course he's going to
want to engage with you.

Make sure you're ready to engage
with him in a way that you like,

that isn't just him coming at you.

Anyway, so, that kind of, all those
expectations and being able to manage

that scenario, those things are
the things that kind of, um, smooth

people into being able to enjoy that
puppyhood instead of constantly being

surprised by how hard you're doing this.

Anke: Yeah, I love that.

I love that.

Because it does kind of
reframe the whole thing.

You, it throws it in your face, that
little, like, that bit of compassion

that's like, yeah, put yourself in, like,
empathy, like, put yourself into that

little puppy's shoes and see, like, How
much change there has been for them, you

know, like something that I hear a lot,
uh, that people say, yeah, you know,

like the sleeping arrangement, right?

You know, there's like funny memes.

It's like, oh yeah, no, the
dogs can sleep in the, in the,

in the, you know, in the crate.

And then, you know, then at the
end of the day, the dog cries and

the dog kind of ends up sleeping.

So like, what's your, what's your take
on like, should the puppies, because

you know, if the puppies in, in, it's.

Kathy: So what I try to do in this
book is free you up because every

dog's an individual, every human's an
individual, households are different.

So I try not to be too prescriptive
of exactly how you should

go about a situation like a
puppy on their first night.

But what I do want to do is free you
up to do what feels right to you.

And for me.

100 percent that is bringing
that puppy in bed with me.

Um, because I'm happy with that.

My husband's happy with that.

We're cool.

Our dogs are fine with that.

So it works for us.

But guess what?

That doesn't work for everyone.

Um, what I will say I want
everyone to do is not leave that

puppy alone that first night.

That is absolutely too shocking.

So for a lot of folks, what works,
um, you know, maybe their partner

doesn't want a dog in the bed.

Maybe they don't want the dog
in the bedroom for whatever

reasons, you know, people have
their reasons for those things.

That's okay.

But the.

But that first night, the first few
nights, maybe the first week, while

that puppy is really confused and
wondering what the heck is up, you need

to be by that puppy's side at night.

And so one thing that can work just
fine is if you're sleeping downstairs

on the couch, that maybe, maybe he's
in a crate and the crate's right

next to the couch and you are just
comforting him through the night.

You're like, you're okay, you're okay.

And you're putting your little fingers
through, um, Um, the, the create and

soothing him and that can be just fine.

So the point is, as you
say, that word empathy.

is your guiding light.

So you figure it out, but
have empathy for this dog.

So you can be down on the
couch next to the crate.

You can have him on your chest
while you're down on the couch.

You can, you can sleep in
the pen with him if you want.

You can, um, you could have him,
there are tiny little carriers.

You could put that on your bed in
between you so he's kind of confined

and you're not worried about pee.

So the reason people don't want
a dog in bed with them because

they think that dogs only pee.

Here's what's interesting.

So Tom and I often, um, have an
eight week old puppy sleeping all

night with us and it's not a problem.

And, um, here is the thing.

The bed itself kind of works as a crate
in that, um, they, they do feel a little

trapped on the bed cause it's too high and
at that age they kind of can't jump off.

So they're sort of stuck in a little
space and dogs want to be naturally clean.

Like I see it even in a three week old.

Like if I have a mom who's given birth
here and the little three weeks old

are starting to eliminate by themselves
and they start to crawl around.

I will see them crawl off their
little mat onto the floor to

eliminate, turn around and crawl back.

These guys have barely opened
their eyes, barely opened their

ears, but their natural instinct
not to eliminate where they live.

is going strong already.

So that is true in an eight week
old as well, unless they've been

screwed up by, by a bad puppy mill
or something where they never had

the option of a clean and a dirty.

Anyway, I digress.

So normal puppies at eight weeks really
do, if they, they don't want to eliminate

right where they're sleeping and living.

So if you put them on the bed with
you, That, that, that kind of works,

like they will sort of hold it, um,
and then, here's the thing, at 5 in

the morning or whatever, so you can't
expect them to hold it for 8 hours, but

you know what, they're gonna hold it
for 6 most often, and so we will go to

bed at 11, and lights out, we're quiet.

Um, and they will snuggle into our
nooks and crannies, just like they used

to snuggle in with their litter mates.

And they feel happy.

You can almost feel them sighing
like, okay, I know what this is.

This is all right.

And they can relax.

Um, but then at five in the
morning, they start walking around.

You better get out there.

So there is no time for
your own bathroom break.

I hate to break it to you.

Do not think that you can stop at the
bathroom, put the puppy down because

the puppy will pee the second those,
those four feet are on the ground.

So you need to scoot outside to the
bathroom area at five in the morning.

But my point is just that that you
can sleep in your own bed with that

puppy right from the beginning and
you probably are going to be able

to have about six hours of sleep.

Lots of people think that they,
a lot of people set the alarm for

like two or and four because they
think the puppy has to eliminate.

The thing is, the puppy will go, like
if you wake them up and you take them

outside, of course they're going to pee.

But often, and then you think,
oh shoot, they really do have to

pee in the middle of the night.

They don't really have to, usually.

It's just that if you give them
the opportunity, they will.

But I can promise you we do
it all the time when we, and

it's when we have a last puppy.

So we call it last puppy syndrome.

So if somebody hasn't been picked yet
out of the litter, that one gets to

get pulled more into our regular life.

And so that one will end up rather
sleeping than sleeping with the puppies

in the puppy den since they're gone now.

We'll pull that one with us.

And I promise you, we've done
this with, I can't even tell you

how many puppies over the years.

They typically go 11 to 5.

And we, you know, you don't feed them, you
have to be a little careful, just like,

you know, think about how this works.

If you give them a giant meal at 10,
they're not going to make it all night.

But if the last time you feed them.

is about 6 at night and if you're
gonna go to bed at 11 and you're

gonna make sure that you give them
a big chance to romp around at 10.

30 and truly eliminate and that doesn't
mean you know you can't just open the door

and say hey do you have to go and assume
that a puppy will go out and go no no no

no no you have to go out put on your shoes
Maybe it's raining, you have to go out

yourself, and if you move around, they're
going to go ahead and empty themselves.

And that gives you, that increases
your odds of having a nice long

sleep because they will be fully
empty by the time you, you attempt

that, that, uh, that big effort.

Actually, this is fun.

This is

Anke: hilarious because I think
like, when I remember like, my

first one later was exactly that.

And I remember my dad, like, my parents
looked after them for a couple of

days, like shortly after he came.

You've got to see him.

And he looked at me like, what happened?

He goes, well, he was asleep
like at 11 in the morning.

Right.

And I speak to my mom and she
goes, well, like Leo would kind of

like, he'd scratch at the door and
every day he goes, Ooh, this works.

So he'd scratch on the inside.

They had him in the bedroom with him.

But so he kind of like,
and then we'll get up.

And then the day after he scratched
five minutes earlier and every day

he scratched a little earlier and
in the end Dev was like up at three

and so he would go back to bed.

But it's like totally
that kind of six hours.

I do remember that with all the, all the
brothers that have come really young.

It's, yeah, it's, it's, and I think,
yeah, empathy is really what it comes.

And that's why I love this, the
book title so much because it really

kind of throws it in your face.

Like you can't kind of unsee it
almost, you know, actually looking at.

Kathy: I think that's right.

Right.

I think that's what people tell
me is that it does just, it's like

it flips a switch in your brain.

And that's the whole thing I wanted
to do was because if you have flipped

that switch and you have that empathy
operating, you're not going to get so mad.

And you're going to be able to see
things more clearly, and you're

going to be able to set stuff up.

It's really about anticipating who
this little puppy is and setting it

up so that she can have her needs met.

Like, of course, she's going to need
to be outside, and she's going to

need to play, and she's going to need
to sniff, and she's going to need to

dig, and she's going to need to chew.

So if you just put in your five minutes
of thinking, The night before, what

am I going to do for her tomorrow?

How does she get to be a dog tomorrow?

Your life is going to be so much better
if instead of that, you thought you

could just go ahead with your regular
life and have a, a movie puppy.

A little fluff.

You

Anke: know, like, you know, sometimes
you think, well, if that bothers you,

that you have to get out, like, yeah,
get a stuffed toy, don't get a dog.

You know?

This is the end of the day.

This is it.

Yeah, puppies, such a short amount
of time, like, you know, we were

just talking, it's like, oh, you turn
around twice and they're big, right?

It's like, I think it's the time
to enjoy them also when they

grow up, when they're so little.

Kathy: Absolutely right.

It is so fleeting.

And that's one of the things that
I try to talk to people is that

if you, the happiest puppy people.

Who turned into the happiest adult dog
people are the people who dive in for

those first six months, maybe a year,
particularly the first six months.

If you dive in and, and
just, Make yourself enjoy it.

And to do that, it means you're
going to have to put some

things on the back burner.

You are going to have to put some of
your social life, maybe some of your

work, some of your exercise, some
of, you know, you're going to have to

put some things on the back burner.

Um, but here's what I find.

I find that, at least for me, what
happens is once you, uh, rearrange

the burners that way, You're happier.

And it, what, what puppyhood can
often give you is a permanent

rearrangement of those burners
where you realize, Oh wait, hang on.

I have more outside time, more
walking time, more time with my

family, more time relaxing at home.

Because what's great
for dogs is hanging out.

And a lot of that stuff
is great for humans too.

And it can be great for your mental
health, great for your relationships,

and um, but I find so many of us have
trouble letting go of the busy, busy,

busy lifestyle we're leading, that we
instead resent the puppy for having needs.

The puppy's barking, uh, what
does he need, what does he need?

And we resent that because it
pulls us away from That's what?

From scrolling?

What is it pulling us away from?

Anyway, um, I just find that if you
can get into the right headspace,

understand this is a puppy, he's
going to have regular puppy needs,

and throw yourselves into that.

Guess what?

You're going to get the joy that
comes from interspecies communication.

relationship.

Like, I personally find it's not that fun.

Like, I don't understand the kind
of people who want to just dominate

a dog and have a little robot next
to them doing exactly what they say.

I certainly do train, I'm a
trainer for goodness sake.

I do train dogs and I absolutely,
I train sit down, stay,

he'll come, all that stuff.

In my view, the way I train that
stuff is to enhance our relationship.

It's not so that the dog will
blindly follow me all the time.

It's basically like a game we
do together that increases.

like lubricates our communication
together, that I teach these

words, they figure out what it is.

Those words tend to, um, you
know, uh, mean that they get

all sorts of great stuff.

You know, there'll be a sit
before we go on a big walk.

There'll be a, um, wait before
I open the car, which is going

to take them to the park.

You know, there's good, those
words and their cooperation with

those words brings a bunch of.

reward to those dogs.

And so we are living together
in a world, we are communicating

together, we understand each other.

And that's just a delight.

If that's not a delight for
you, I just don't have at all.

Like, yeah, I just, it is so much fun.

And you will, you will learn so much
more if you're open to it, to who this

individual dog is, you will, Learn so
much about yourself and about, you know,

every dog has something to teach you.

If instead you have this vision of exactly
who this little puppy has to grow up to

be and exactly the behaviors this dog
has to do, you're going to be frustrated

and you're also going to miss it.

You're going to miss That's who this
dog actually is because you will be

suppressing all this dog's natural
behavior and replacing it with this

stuff you're trying super hard to,
um, push down the dog's throat.

And it's just It's

Anke: similar with kids when
you think about it, right?

Yep.

It's the same thing, like, people,
when you have, you know, oh, I want

the kid to be a dancer, and the kid
doesn't, doesn't want to be a dancer,

you've got the same problem, right?

So you can, you, you, you know, and
I always looked at whatever I kind of

teach the dogs, like, the only purpose
this really has is to keep the dog safe.

You know, like, what's the
only reason I don't want them

to run out, like, the door?

It's because there could be a car
coming or, like, something could happen.

Like, it's almost like for them to listen
to me saying, wait, or stop, or whatever.

The only purpose it has for me is,
like, to make sure I can keep you

safe because you're living in a
human environment, you know, so that

you need to know a few things to
basically get through a life, you know?

Kathy: That's, that's really right.

And also, um, to make sure that, you know,
you are in a human world and the dog's

life is going to be better if other humans
in general feel positively about the dog.

So in that sense, you also don't
want your dog jumping all over

your guests and jumping up because
you want all that to go well.

Um, And that does sort of extend
the safety of the dog I suppose.

Um, and then the other thing is
it's just something to do together.

Like if you're sitting there and it's
a rainy day and you can't go for a

big hike and you can't do, guess what?

You know what you can do?

You can sit on the couch
and you can play ping pong.

Leslie, Leslie McDevitt's little fun
ping pong game where you're playing

find it and going back and forth and
asking for a little trick in the middle.

Stuff like that.

Those little.

Training games.

It's just like playing
Bananagrams with your kids.

Like, it's a thing to do to pass the time.

Here we are on earth together.

There are going to be a few laughs.

When you sit around and you play
games with your kids, you laugh.

You build your relationship.

You get to know each
other a little bit better.

Yes, there's a little brain
growth that happens as well.

And it's the same for me with
training with dogs, as I'm doing

it for that fun reason as well.

But I'm really not doing it because
I insist on having a dog who performs

at a certain level doing exactly these
things just like my old dog, you know?

I want there to be a lot of room for
this dog to be who this dog really is.

Anke: I love that.

So where can people go and get
the book, find out more about you?

Sure.

You know, stalk you on Instagram.

Sure.

Kathy: Yes.

Okay.

So the fun thing to do is stalk me on
Instagram when I have a foster litter.

So my Instagram is puppy pics.

I think it's puppy.

pix, P U P P Y dot pix, P I C K S.

Um, and that's fun when I
do have a foster litter.

So this, this spring I took in a
pregnant mom, had seven puppies.

They were a delight.

They, so you can watch their whole growth
and they still come for, to play at

my house, which is awfully fun for me.

They're about 12 weeks old now.

Um, so that's Instagram.

I'm also on Facebook.

I'm Kathy.

Gord Callahan at Facebook, and I do
post there all those puppies as well.

And sometimes I put, I will
also post some training videos

and training tips there too.

But then the big thing is the book.

The book is Welcoming Your Puppy
from Planet Dog, and you can get it

wherever you like to get your books.

My website is www.

puppypics.

com.

P U P P Y P I C K S dot com.

And I'd love to connect with you.

Anke: Thank you so much.

This was delightful.

I could talk copies with you all day long.

I know, right?

Right?

Such a great topic.

Such a brilliant topic.

So thank you so much.

And you know, I might get you back on.

Awesome.

You know, we'll, we'll find another.

I actually have already an idea,
but we'll talk about that offline.

So thank you.

Thank you so much.

Kathy: All right.

Nice to be here.

Thank you.

Bye.

Thanks so much for listening.

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